Most People Don't Know How Bikes Work

Like how we intuitively learned what a parabola is playing catch. Long before it was formally discovered

Like Blinking

@@ham1872 that’s less impressive because it’s preprogrammed, not learned

well you know how to do it, because your subconscious understands it
its just that your consciousness doesnt register it as the same
its like that with a lot of stuff, like almost everything
if you think about it, it feels like we are a slower and dumber version of our subconscious selfs

I mean that is how they teach you in school. You have to do something, remember something and do it without thinking about it. You can tell that Pi is Pi becouse its Pi and its made to calculate the circle and ahit but a lot less people know why Pi exist and why it works. Its scary how people are made to just "do" things and not undrestand them at all.

How the turntables ...

You don't build a bicycle, bicycle builds you.

I see what you did there 👌

sure

what about bananalogic

I can

I used to ride all around town with no hands. One day I went down a hill and rounded a bend at the bottom of the hill. My front tire went into a small but deep pot hole that I didnt even see. I smashed my face and had to go to the ER and a plastic surgeon to fix the hole in my nose.

@@justind4763 🤔🤔🤔

Not just wide turns at high speed. You can start with no hands, get up to speed with no hands, orbit people with no hands... I use my hands on difficult terrain or when I need the brakes.

@@EvpatijK. what?

Not really.
The more stuff you understand, the more you realize that you don't really understand those things.

I love it

Yeah really only for science-fans, not people with an actual scientist mindset. We dont know most things about everything
We cant even predict the motion pattern of a swinging 2 bar linkage

It’s wild to think we still don’t entirely understand a human-made device invented nearly 140 years ago. It’s not like there haven’t been advancements to it since then either, and all without entirely understanding the how of it all. Human intuition is incredible

It gets even weirder. The language which is used to describe the concept of a bike is itself not a bike, right? So in order to understand something you need to create something else? It gets even weirder, but I'll stop now before the lizard people find me.

I did actually tell my kid this, I didnt know this was something people didn't know. Its also very obvious that you have to do this on a motorbike.

@@VengeanceCore My dad explained this to me when I was learning to ride a bike and it actually screwed me up, cause I was always actively trying to countersteer and I always went too far. But maybe that's just me.

@I'm just here for the asmr 💕 riding a bike doesn't give you confidence
You find that within yourself, I think

Dumbest statement ever bro LOL.

@@bobsmith6544 why you gotta do me like that though D:

lol

ayo my favourite embery piano dog

Ah yes, Doc Hudson instinct had prevail the truth.

Reminds me of the scandinavian or Finnish flick in rally!

The mechanics said Lightning McQueen would never race again.

Motorcycle turning is very different although initiated the same.
At very slow speeds you are relying on the centre of gravity to keep the bike upright and you turn by steering in the direction you want to go.
At higher speeds, yes you initiate them with counter-steering but it's because you ARE using the gyroscopic effect - much faster wheel speeds with much heavier wheels.
So there's not the second turn back that is shown in in this video with bicycles, after the counter-steering.
These differences are even more dramatic when braking on a curve.
I had to have a tendon reattached after crashing my motorbike the first time back on it in years after many years riding bicycles, because I didn't realise my muscle memory was all wrong, and ended up braking into a median strip because I braked in a straight line.

@@AndyDentPerth All 2 wheels vehicles turn the same way, by leaning into the turn and using tires with rounded thread profile to allow it (as opposed to car's flat ones). The major difference between bike vs bicycle is the effect of the rider's body to initialte a turn. A lot on the bicycle, less on the motorcyle where the proportion of you weight over the total weight is not as great, plus the heavier wheels have more inertia (gyroscopic effect)...Thus steeting with the handlebar is more efficient than steering only with your body (same for the bicycle by the way, especially at high speed). But fondamentaly, they are the same.
And as explained in the video, turning the handlebars to the right will make the vehicle "fall" to the left and thus turn left, and vice versa.

​@AndyDentPerth Everything you just said is wrong. Turning a motorcycle at any speed is initiated and stopped by counter steering. You're not using the gyroscope effect, you're fighting it. The second turn back into the direction of the turn after the initial counter steer is also done on a motorcycle. You might not notice it but that doesn't change the fact that it's happening.

And that is the only way to fight the side winds.

I realised this when, as a teenager working at a fast food restaurant I was asked to take their comically oversized tricycle and go and pick up trash around the restaurant.
Being used to riding a bike simply by leaning, and counter-steering, but never having thought about it, I just kept going into the wrong direction, in public, on a freaking tricycle!
I provided very good amusement to my colleagues that day (And refused to ever ride the stupid thing afterwards)

Is a 100mph high speed sweeper the same or is the counter steer a endless phenomenon? Head tube angle 📐 and bike style also comes play. Cafe bike with steep head tube angle are the extreme examples. Counter steering is best demonstrated by viewing a remote controlled motorcycle. Crazy

@@EtaSoon777 It depends whether you're talking about from a practical perspective or a mechanical perspective. From a mechanical perspective, motorcycles/bicycles steer in turns at any speed... "counter steering" is just a methodology for explaining the technique used to control it.
From a practical perspective, in a high speed turn you have to keep pressure on the inside bar in order to maintain the turn. If you release pressure, front wheel castor (even on a bike with a steep head tube angle) causes the bike to steer deeper into the turn until the point where the wheels are brought back under the center of gravity.

Контрруление помогает только на уклонах, посмотри внимательно на гонщиков MotoGP...

@Observ45er You figure that out yourself? 🙄

@@EvpatijK. Counter-steering works on flat surfaces as well. You just have to be going fast enough. (Hopefully Google translates my response well enough)

Veritasium-Fans, I have the Hobby to recommen Science-KRplusrs to Fans of Science-KRplus-Channels.

What the hell are we doing trying to get to mars when we haven’t figured out bicycles yet 😂

Gives me the same energy as inventing the Rubik's Cube and then not being able to resolve it

@@Chimera_Photography XD

It's always funny to me how humans can create things before actually understanding how they actually work

Exactly it's why the combustion engine should never go away

@@borncomatose Unless you power your bike with lit farts, I think we're talking about two different things

@@z-beeblebrox lit farts sounds much cooler to me

The actual combustion engine is a cool thing, it’s just it’s fuel source. But still a really interesting piece of engineering, although not as simple as the bike tho.

@@z-beeblebrox no because if it exists for years, stills works and still gets improvements then it's literally the same mental as you 🤣 lmao ur just slow

They have one to borrow at the sience museum in Copehagen, Danmark.Takes some time to get "reprogammed"

more like right and left if it was stationary ?

Hahahahahahhahah. That’s funny

How do you turn the wheels on a bike thats stationary and also touching the ground? That would make the bike move, no?

@@user-so2fp8tz9o guess they meant the handlebar

​@@user-so2fp8tz9o they were pedaling backwards

I don’t know why they even teach “counter steering” like there is an alternative. If you don’t “counter steer” then you don’t ride a motorcycle lol.

@@TheKep I had found the way it was explained in class was way more complex than it actually was. But that is down to the instructor

@@whiskytangofoxtrot_ I was going to comment the same thing. My instructor taught that if you want to go right you need to "press" on the right handlebar. It felt unnecessarily confusing, and was probably just better left not being said. People intuitively know how to steer as long as they know how to ride a bicycle.

Sure -at low speeds motorcycles act the same way - At speed you "turn" the opposite way you want to go the entire time. Try it - going down the highway press forward on the left handle bar. The bike will lean left and turn left.

@@mactraynor6243 To me it's the opposite order. To go left I lean left. But to prevent the bike from "falling over" I have to press left to counter steer.

Lovely comment!

And people can understand the mechanics and not be able to do it.

I agree

Or even simpler, being able to catch something thrown at you. Many intense mathematical calculations are subconsciously made in split seconds to know the trajectory of the object and where and when to catch it.

As a shooter and basketball player, please do not discredit the thousand of hours “in the lab” where we learn the mechanics and physics of putting the ball through the basket (no matter the conditions) through sheer repetition and proper coaching. It’s not like we’re doing math of course but we’re still learning and experiencing it through all of our senses. The depth of understanding is subjective I agree but “dumb jocks” often know their particular stuff “down to a science”.

As an interviewer you would have got extra points for that. It is essential that people in technical positions understand the extend of their knowledge and are honourable enough to admit such even in high pressure situations where revealing the limit of your knowledge could be detrimental to you personally. The worst answer in the world is to try and bluff your way through.

but how do hula hoops stay in equilibrium during motion but falls when its stationary?

@@apekshamaheshwari9666 speed invert gravity force. sam,e with the bike wheel experiment horizontal

They were just hoping you knew the answer so they could take credit at the nobel prize ceremony

Questions like that are actually geared towards to checking the ability of the applicant to acknowledge when they dont understand something.
Because in any medical field, the biggest danger to patients, are professionals who cant accept that they dont know something.

The people who designed them probably didn't realise either. It was just an accident that they discovered the principles shown in the video.

They haven't changed very radically in the 150 some odd years since we pretty much figured them out. Only took us about 60-70 years from the very first two wheeler to basically reach the peak of bicycle tech.
Kinda strange that no one had gotten around to inventing a bicycle until just 200 years ago. The wheel had been around for a good long while already. Surely the other components of a bike could've been readily cobbled together for a few hundred years before they finally were. I dunno.

@@conalbennett8259 it was kinda just an iterative thing. Early bikes looks funky and they just kept what worked and replaced what didnt work.

Yah a steering wheel...deep

@@ultramaga4075 see that's how I used to feel, but now that I know the mechanics behind it it feels a lot more impressive

Same here. I have to be going pretty slow to use the counter steer to turn. To stay balanced at low speed I of course let my instinctive counter steer take over.

It's the opposite way round. Get up some speed, take your hands off the bars and see how fast you can turn, then try the same at low speed.

@@Observ45er you can shift your centre of gravity easily, move your head, shoulders, upper body mas, even lower body mas if standing, and the knee on the side you want to move outwards, and your entire weight has shifted. Then the bike will follow and lean that direction also. Centre of gravity is easily manipulated on a bike.

@@Observ45er ok, get on a bike and try it. It works. Without getting all scientific, you can just get on a bike and try. It's the same as standing up. Do it, stand up now. Lean to the side, you will start to fall to the side, not the opposite side, but the side you lean.
On a swing you have your pivot above you, you are the force, and the reaction happens below you, you move the opposite way.
Put it this way, roll down hill on a bike, lean. Just lean to the right let's say. If you want to, you can lean right, and not react, do not turn the handle bars, and just fall all the way to the ground. Or, you can lean to the right, and just like if you stand up right now and lean to the right, you will start to fall to the right. On the bike, as you start to fall, you turn you handle bars to the right and your force now goes into the bend.
I mean try it. I test it on the way to work. I encourage you to get on a bike, roll down hill and just lean to the side, as if you are trying to topple over, which you can do, you can just lean and fall. But then follow the lean with the rotation of the handle bars and, boom, you are turning.
Use science to understand the findings. In this case you don't need science to predict the outcome, it's just a bike, you can go and do it.
I believe you may be imagining this as a stationary bike or slow moving. Where if trying to balance without moving, when you lean right, you will push the bike out left, to keep the gravity centre. But at a speed, when trying to turn, as in move to the right, you do not want gravity centre. You fall right and then follow with a turn to the right, and the force gets pushed into the ground.
Ah, I mean, do the experiment. It proves itself.
Alright, peace.

@@abehartshorne6028 Bingo. I was an elite cyclist in my youth. Road bikes work at speed for a reason. Your feet on the pedals just forms a triangle to the ground.
Like walking, we are always just about to fall. I think this experiment
needs to be revisited with pros and armatures. Plus different stiles of
bikes and do it on the old Alameda Naval Air strip.

Yes and no, if you were anything like my 4 year old is now, your dad could have tried to explain this to you till he was red in the face and it still would not made sense. I eventually stopped trying, but I really wanted to try and get this across as he was switching from training wheels where you actually turn the wheel the way you want to go.

@@alexgavinchuk5555 exactly. A lot of things don't make sense when they are explained or presented at first. Speaking as a teacher. Sometimes you kind of have to break through the subject yourself before you understand that information that was given to you or even explained many times without you fully understanding it :(
It can literally take years :(

Oh training wheels... I think they are completely counterproductive to learning to ride a bike. They make you get used to a certain mechanism of riding, and then you're somehow supposed to learn a completely new way to ride a bike, fighting your subconscious and your reflexes? Imo it's deeply unhelpful. Just learning to ride a normal bike right away has to be easier.

@@y-yyy am I correct in assuming that training wheels are the 2 wheels on the back wheel of the bike? They aren't called that in my native language (we simply call it a 4-wheel bicycle), hence the question.

@@atriyakoller136 correct, that is the term used in America for them.

In that case, an even better example is the video: "consequences of not understanding counter-steering on a motorcycle".
At first it's tough to watch, but they explain the rider is okay. It's very educational.

I have no idea that I have been doing it every time I ride a bike until I watched this video.

Good!

Having not learned to bike until my 20's, I was aware of countersteering.
Wasn't aware it was for balance. I just thought it was to make turns not so sharp. Like, get far right to begin the left turn sooner.
My countersteering may be more pronounced though.

The only thing I nitpick is why in the world people in small cars countersteer all the way into my lane before making their turn 🫠

I learned how to ride a bike at 17. It took about 20-30 minutes of me on the street looking very similar to the people in the video, and then, all of a sudden, it clicked which was a very strange feeling.

Special Ed 🤨

@@LexieGuilbert 'flash news' some people dont know how to ride a bike

If you're still teaching her, teach her how to ride slow before riding fast.

@@LexieGuilbert I'm happy to know that you are the exception that learns everything immediately. Congratulations, I'm not sure how you get anything done when faced with actual difficulty.

As long as Mike is there, he should be okay

My thoughts exactly!

That would be a great collaboration

I just watched that video!

That's the video showing after this for me

So I just watched a video of Peter Sagan cornering.
He starts the turn by leaning, presumably with the saddle as the contact point. He turns left by leaning left and following with the bars. He never turns the bars to the right.
I feel like this video is a flawed model that doesn't really cover the full gamut of what entails turning on a bicycle.

xdxd

"... gyroscopic procession..." ???

Hoo boy. Trials riding would be quite the physics lesson.

@@hsw268 see from about 8:40

@just some guy tired of life What?

I remember having my mind blown by this when I first rode a motorcycle. Like I knew bicycles had some self-righting properties, but the countersteer there is so fast and light and intuitive that you don't really notice it. On a motorcycle, you contribute so much less to the inertia, it's more like you're an observer of the dynamics than a part of them. The first time you push the handlebars opposite the direction you want to go and the bike just eases over into the turn is such a cool moment.

I was just about to comment something similar, I'm glad to have found this comment already here

Came here to say the same thing. There are tons of videos on counter steer for motorcycles. This video is actually one of the best IMO because it uses more examples than just motorcycles

I remember trying this when I first started riding motorcycles. On the freeway at 75mph, if you push the left bar up, like you were making a right turn, the bike leans left. Its odd passing cars on the highway like that.

I have a friend who rides his bicycle to work every day and has been for the past 3 years. We were out on a bike trail and when we took a little rest at the turn around point, I told him about countersteering (I had just started riding a motorcycle and it was fresh in my mind); it ruined the rest of the trip for him. Now that he was consciously aware of what was happening he kept steering all over the place trying to test out this newfound discovery and ended up crashing at one point. Crazy how people can master something and have no idea how it even works.

The same when you turn without holding the handles

Yeah I've never used counter steering even after watching this video. It feels way more intuitive to lean and then steer

yep this whole video is totally wrong, coz when u block the specific turn, what actually happens is u ruin ur balancing, so u just fall off BEFORE u even try to do anything.
in reality, u can totally turn without countersteering, yes, by leaning first a bit and following with the handlebars as soon as bike starts losing its balance, and this is preferable way to turn in specific situations, like, in winter for example, this way u dont have to lean too much.
however, in any normal situation its preferable to always go for countersteering, coz its faster and more reliable, and with the speed the ability to not-countersteer loses efficiency extremely fast, like at 50kmph ur turn radius is gonna be somewhat like 20m with countersteering and 50m without, so basically u cant even turn in a city at this speed without countersteering.

I only use counter steering when I'm making a u turn or doing a dramatic turn before stopping.
any other occasion I start the turn by leaning. This ain't a motorcycle you can overpower it with body weight.
@@nigeladams8321

Also, we put a man on the moon before we put wheels on our luggage.

Time travel exist hahah. YOU bring it to the UNKNOWN

Actually 14 years earlier

It's like we learn words first and then alphabets

I believe this was European history as much of the rest of the world is still lacking in both technologies.

can he not ? is there any video of his in which he says this?

Watch yesterday's Tom Scott Plus video

@@sajid_ahamed
Yesterday’s video on his second channel, with Mike Boyd.

*Laughs in dutch*

@@ragnkja just watched it, unreasonably funny

It's possible to steer without countersteer just sayin

cyclist are weirdos

Years ago a motorcycle racing teacher welded the steering on a track motorcycle to prove this same point to deniers.

@@morry32 whats your purpose of saying that

@@morry32 aren’t you just salty because you can’t ride a bicycle yourself?

@@MyuuriShiina Clearly, he’s a cyclist.

My thoughts exactly! :D
And also responding to the "gyroscopic effect" statement along the way

Dereked again!

exactly what I thought LOL

He would have learned how to ride it in 30 minutes.

@@arshad4695 on the tom scott plus channel, he learned to ride a bike from mike boyd whose channel is about him learning new skills

4 levels on competence. The highest is unconscious competence and that’s when we do things without knowing how or why we can do it! Super neat.

In David Eagleman's book Incognito he recounts an experiment where people were asked to close their eyes and "act out" how they would change lanes in a car. Similarily, most people got it all wrong and would have crashed into the curb. They steered left on an imaginary wheel, and then positioned their hands in the original position again. But everybody missed that you actually have to countersteer to the right again for the car to go straight ahead, and not keep swerving left. Very interesting to me.

Noone has to calculate their trajectory to know how hard they need to jump to hop over a pothole. The ability of fleshythings to grasp physics is truly neat when mathematical and biological knowledge of how it works is esoteric to most.

I struggle to ride a bike and have since I was a kid. I still try to ride periodically and can go awhile but find it stressful. I’m always hyperaware that I need to counter-steer and found that out the hard way as a kid when I turned the handlebars without and took a nasty fall. Actually knowing this makes it harder for me to ride. Lol

It's called mastering a skill and forgetting that you mastered it just like a baby learning to walk it becomes part of you 😎

Spot on!! 👌🤟 i was waiting for someone to say that

I heard that for a motorcycle, the profile of the tire is also important for cornering. Riders are taught that they need to put more throttle to go around a corner at the same speed than if they went straight, and that is because the tire has a smaller diameter on the sides than in the middle, so when cornering, you need to wheel rpm to maintain the same speed. But also, when the tire is tilted, the tire has larger diameter on the outside than the inside of the contact patch, and because the wheel spins as one piece, the larger diameter has to drive a larger distance, so the tire traces a curved path. It basically acts as a differential. I have difficulties joining this with the subject of the video. Am I talking out of my ass? Are they just complementary effects? Can you steer a motorcycle/bicycle on razor thin tires that have no profile?

That was a hard question to answer on the test. I got it wrong. The question on my test was a bit different, and the only available answers were weird. The question was: which way do you press the handle bars to turn right. Just putting the whole deal into words was weird enough. Not about leaning like you said (and I would have thought.)
I never thought about how I press the right handle bar forward, and therefore start falling (and turning) right. The whole thing was a little counterintuitive.

@@flashpeter625 they are just different phases of the turn. You use counter steering to lean the motorcycle from a vertical position, and once it's leaned the tire profile kicks in and that keeps the motorcycle along the curve.

There is 2 books on the subject I would highly recommend. Bicycling science, and motorcycle chassis design. There both very interesting and definitely worth a read.

As a kid I couldn't figure out how to ride a bike for around a week. However I suddenly figured it out after watching another kid falling off of their own bike.

I didn't realise the quote ended until the period after thought, but I prefer it that was.

I thought the saying was just “you never forget how to ride a bike”

@@nataleeisjustchilling2737 cant believe anyone would be rude to a bike

@@kalidos7681 oops lol my bad I fixed it

I just re-watched his old video yesterday and now this gets uploaded a few minutes ago .. freaky!

And make a super impossible bike to ride.

@@Robert-cu9bm That's the plan.

With Tom Scott.

Yeah I remember this bicycle from destin’s video

Cute but reality is different. Bicycles can be balanced at zero speed.

@@stevek8829 You just had to be pedantic dude lol

@@stevek8829 you forgot to mention that you have to be at exact angle to do that (probably irrelevant, but still)

@@Krecconati you didn't mention what exact angle might that be? They do it at many angles and positions. I didn't forget something that isn't true.

@@kuyab9122 It's what happens when someone has no friends or life.

Was looking for this comment. I guess as a competitive cyclist I have been able to become aware that the correct technique to corner at higher speeds and even more efficiently is to lean and essentially countersteer a little bit. The countersteer is not something you practice but rather the weighting of the bike is huge. Getting more weight closer to over your wheels and tires allows you to increase grip because of what i assume to be increased contact patch and some physics. Cool to read! Thanks

@@wellstanner3216 This video is for and about how tourists ride those blue rental bikes. Try steering this way (as shown in the video) on a downhill at 40mph and have your dentist on speed-dial.

​@@gigabrother458 YES. Exactly this. I often feel as though the plot gets lost in some of these explanations.
When you are going sufficiently fast enough, a slight shift of your weight by leaning the bike and body are enough to allow for a turn without having to first turn the handlebars in the opposite direction.
If you look at a video of a person steering without touching the handlebars, you will find at even lower speeds that shifting weight will turn the wheel in the intended direction of travel. Unicycles can also be brought up, but that's slightly outside scope i think.
Imo the correct explanation in this video should be that bikes are steered primarily by shifting weight not by turning the handles. The handles are there for comfort and precision/stability.

you wouldn't have to stand up right? i mean i can already do it by sitting and only leaning to a side

@@rndviddump304 I think you're missing the point slightly - it's very difficult/unnatural to "shift weight" on a bicycle without being able to manipulate the steering. Slight adjustments to the steering is how one compensates for shifting weight.
This is also true on a bike that is ridden with no hands - only in that case the rider has to be sensitive/careful enough about their weight distribution that they can make minor steering adjustments by balance. It's a positive feedback control system, so in order to turn right with no hands, the rider intuitively will start with a very slight lean to the left, and induce a left turn in the steering wheel before leaning right to turn.
Most people find this a bit difficult (and it very much depends on the inherent stability of the bike), so they instead make minor (read: pre-turn) steering adjustments with their hands, and then as you say, actually lean to make turns. But in either case, control of the steering is critical to maintain balance.

This. Any motorcyclist worth their salt should have at least a basic understanding of countersteering.

The issue with steering wrongly in this type of situation is because people tend to steer where they look.

I was about to say this

It's not even possible to ride a motorcycle through a curve without deliberately counter-steering into, and out of, the turn. The higher the speed, the more acute the effect.

@@jj4791 Most people will countersteer intuitively, but this does not necessarily translate to high stress situations, which is why every motorcyclist should know and understand this effect in my opinion.

Not really. You balance by throwing off your balance, which involves steering.

The bicycle still steers when you don't have your hands on the bar. Why was being dutch significant?

@@123698lol Because everyone in the Netherlands bikes almost on a daily basis and many do not use the steering wheel. It is like steering with a unicycle it is all in the balance and the speed.

@@khamultheeasterling4459 Bicycles usually don't have steering wheels, at least not outside Netherlands.

Learning about weight transfer in cars is honestly one of the coolest things that's ever happened to me. I had an understanding beforehand that turning the wheel excessively wasn't going to help the turn, but finding out that just by entering with a slight angle and playing with the brake and gas pedals I could get entries with minimal steering and less tire wear was so fun. Also kicked off an interest in sim drifting.

wow

This is why people saying that you "just have to lean" into the turn on your scooter or motorbike are just plain wrong and the cause of many injuries and deaths. Countersteering is the ONLY safe and effective way to learn how to ride a bike. Almost all bike crashes are caused by people panicking and not countersteering when required. Telling people to "just lean into the turn" should be considered the same legally as giving instructions and encouraging someone to commit suicide. It is literally the same.

The go cart thing, that's because you're putting more weight on the front tires causing it to slip less. One would assume that the tires dont slip when the vehicle is turning, but that's not the case.

@@cokecan6169 I don't want you to get into dangerous hobbies, but you should try motorcycles, that takes driving/riding technique to a finer stage.
Also I've been sim drifting on grid autosport, whihc is pretty dope

Was just thinking that the experiment was missing that. Lemme see that figure 8 on a 1k bike

You mean keeping your body upright while leaning the bike into the turn? Bicyclists do that too at low speeds.

but isnt that only at low speed, like at high speed we dont counter lean

This video just proves he has never ridden a bike. Pushing to turn instead of pulling is just too hard.

I was thinking of saying something like this but you beat me to it.

wow

This is some real wisdom. Thanks.

yea brain is just too mysterious

@@beezmanit2683 says the brain

When you're an expert at falling forward without injury you can become an expert at falling perfectly on anything.

As a bicyclist I've never been consciously aware of turning the handlebars to initiate a normal turn, but I've never ridden a bike that weighed more than perhaps 30 pounds. If my bike weighed several hundred pounds and the rotating wheels weighed 20 pounds or more I presume that I'd have to steer the bike out from under me to shift the weight.

It's one of the first things you learn when learning to ride a motorcycle. Push the handlebar in the direction you intend to turn. The property is FAR more apparent when riding a motorcycle. Going faster speeds you also need to counter steer through the entire turn instead of just the beginning of the turn.

also why having a strong dampener is a good thing on bumpy roads.

Agreed, motorcycles are much heavier too, need a lot more rider input to execute aggressive manoeuvres

Yeah you REALLY become aware when your bike is suddenly 600lbs instead of 40lbs lmao

>> going to test this theory when I get home
It's actually kind of difficult to test. At higher speeds, the amount of counter-steering can be quite small - and subconscious. But the more aggressive your turn, the more aggressive the counter-steer will have to be to initiate it. Some folks have mentioned in the comments that they can always see the track of the front wheel counter-steering after going through a puddle. Perhaps you'll be able to see it in the dirt as well.

@@Rick_Cavallaro It is very simple test.
The problem is that even when you fully concetrate, the countersteering effect is still very subtle and hard to notice.
It will be easier to notice on a heavier motorbike.

As a fellow mountain biker, my friend and I do not counter steer at all when riding, at least not enough for his iphone slow mo to pick up. Maybe its unique to just me an him, or it could be mountain biker thing due to having less room on turns to counter steer

@@alexchene4064 It's easy to believe that you don't see it on video - particularly when riding faster, and definitely harder to see when you're linking left and right turns. It's easiest to see if filmed from directly in front and initiating a turn from riding straight. But I can very nearly assure you that you're both doing it. Some people have also mentioned that it's easiest to see by looking at the difference between the front and rear wheel tracks on the ground.

@@alexchene4064 You do it all the time, every time.
Even when you ride straight (straight as possible) you constantly countersteer.

just lean the entire bike instead of just turning the handle/front wheel, can be a pain at slow speeds but still possible, just don't sit and counter balance with your body. You don't need to turn the handle/front wheel to turn (or barely for sharper turns but after the bike lean so still no need to counter steer).

Technically it is a psychological barrier - no physics force is blocking you from falling onto the road

Yes, very treacherous situation, I know exactly what you mean. Trying to squeeze past cars on the curb side will get you into that :P When it happens to me I try to keep a centimeter or so of space between the tyre wall and the curb. It's enough to countersteer. Also if it does happen that space runs out a quick hard jerk on the handle bars will warp the tyre enough to shift the centre of gravity into the favorable direction. So never blow up your front tyre too hard because that makes it harder for such an emergency maneuver. Mind that my bike has a fairly thin front tyre as it's an all-road type bike (Honda XL600V Transalp 1994) and I mostly ride on studded tyres

If you reach the point where your front tyre is brushing the kerb, you can neither steer away nor lean away. If you're going too fast to stop, only a bunnyhop over the kerb will save you.

When learning to ride a motorcycle you learn about counter steering, but you also learn about target fixation. Target fixation means that you go where you look, so if you see a hazard in the road, and you focus on it to try and avoid it, you will instead run into it. Counter intuitively you have to try and focus on where the hazard is not, and you'll be fine. So in your case it's probably both a psychological and a physics problem.

Yes

yep

3 wheel robin?

Also, to add when driving in reverse you have toe out in the front wheels, which makes the wheels want to turn, not go straight.
But doesn’t apply to 2 wheeled stuff.

@@strangeclouds58 The Reliant Robin is a car that only has 3 wheels.

I was going to say this too. But yeah, first thing you're taught.

Push left to turn left.

Motorcycles are a lot heavier, however. To turn a motorcycle, you have to shift the weight of the vehicle, which requires counter steering. To turn a bicycle, you have to shift the weight of your body, which does not require counter steering. It's just that most people don't really train themselves to do that, as keeping your body static in relation to the bicycle and using counter steering is the easiest riding style. You can trivially show that counter steering is not required by letting go of the handlebars and steering by shifting your weight. You can also prove that counter steering is not required by letting a bike coast without a rider and observing that it turns in the direction it leans without any counter steering being performed, e.g. at 7:24 in this very video.

Came here to say something similar.

@@MichaelLazorchak "push left to turn left" I ride motorcycle and I remember when I first started I was SSOOOO amazed and confused by this.

And they still do today.

An amazing video for that is: "consequences of not understanding counter-steering on a motorcycle".
At first it's tough to watch, but they explain the rider is okay. It's very educational.

yep, and when you're at speed steering is always with countersteer, which is a little scary when you think about it lol

@@disturbeddonut2151
Unless you going slow.

Yes, and it's much more obvious on a motorcycle. They very explicitly teach you to literally push the handlebar of the side that you want to turn into, to induce the lean. Want to turn left? Push left. Want to turn faster in a tight corner, even though you're already leaning and turning? Push left more!

@@farLander1 Yes but it is tiny compared to low speed counter-steering.

And they do this because it it harder to move the bike from side to side quickly with your bodyweight, at speed, counter steering is way faster! In some countries, dodging a couple of cones at 50 km/h using counter steering is part of your exam.

Sir Newton want to talk with you.

Omg, no. The bike WILL NOT TURN without changing the direction of the wheel.

You've never thought of how turns work with trains, have you?@@jridenour31 Same principle, but applied in reverse. Bike wheels are round and create a small flat patch where they contact the ground; when the bike is completely vertical the bike goes straight because that entire area is moving the same speed, when the bike leans it causes the further edge of that patch to be moving faster and thus induces a gradual turn.

👍

I remember this, essentially you use your own body as the handlebars to preform the steering.

Finally, a video that's relevant to my life

@@Flameancer its all in the hips to steer

@@AdderallXR831 for me it was in the upper torso, I would shift it to the left to go left, and right to go right. It is much more noticeable when riding without using hands

I used to think of the transistor as the greatest invention of all time but I changed my mind a few years ago for the bicycle. It's efficient, it's cheap, it's eco-friendly...
...and it can surely teach us some physics as well.

@@jagatiello6900 I think that greatest invention so far is likely money. Something that we all use and are familiar with, but so many things are still unknown about how precisely it behaves and why. But after that to me comes psychology. It's fascinating how we try to understand how we think/behave, while using just one or few brains. Sounds like paradox, trying to outsmart the literal brains to explain why it does what it does. But yeah, bicycles are cool too, but more precisely bicycle engineering and physics.

@@MJ-uk6luNot sure if psychology counts as an "invention"....

Well, my 6 year old mountain bike, the one I paid £2000 for, is considered by many “unridable” because its head angle is steeper by 1 degree, and the reach measurement is 20mm shorter than the latest model. What was once called “responsive steering” is now called “twitchy AF”. Even though we now know what sort of works, and what kinda doesn’t, bikes are still evolving and they will for years to come.

@@extragoogleaccount6061 I guess it doesn't, but as science subject it's interesting, but also absurd (due to my mentioned paradox). It seems to have no end and it's impossible to accurately find answers with it.

Then you start challenging yourself to actually ride the UNRIDEABLE bicycle and guess what.
Our body does move with everything

as an internet and youtube engineer, i commend this comment

Whats the point of mc schools teaching counterstering when everybody already know how to do it whithout knowing what it is?

or turn left to make a right.

@@einarberg7870 get on a motorcycle some time. Counter steering is definitely not the intuitive way you will try to control it. The extra weight of the bike will make you want to shift your weight to muscle the bike the direction you want to go. This bad habit is very ineffective though. Thus teaching correct steering technique.

@@einarberg7870 u learn this because the speed of a motorcycle and weight is allot higher, I'm taking my license now and yeah you will do it automatically, but when u know this actively u can go faster and have more controll in a corner.

@@einarberg7870 I learned it at a racing school. The point is they want people to do it more purposefully and aggressively when they need to take different lines to pass each other in turns. They also don't want you to just gently and instinctively fall into the turn, you want to be assertive and enter the turn with purpose. Have you ever been on a racetrack?

Yeah i would like to see someone who can throw the bike around under them. When I want to turn left I dont lean left, I usually just lift my knee and lean the frame over to somewhere between 45 and 90 degree. I am not saying I could still cycle the bike, however it would be interesting to see whats happening and would happen if the bike was changed slightly. Also Id like to see what happens when people get up and run on the bike, with the frame violently moving from left to right as they go straight on.

Separating lean from steer is something most kids learn early on, but that'd help, yes... The stuntmen may be able to pick the right wheel off the ground, and scoot around on the rear wheel exclusively, changing directions as required and so forth (like in "the nosebleed section").

you can lean and ride straight but you can't steer without leaning, i don't believe its necessary to counter steer first to make a turn, since you can drive a bike without hands, where only leaning is applied, so if those people are as good as you say they are (idk since i've never heard of them), i don't think they would have a problem riding that bike. I have also payed much more attention since i saw this video, and since i've been interested in the similiar phenomenom i noticed a few years ago, and u would have a hard time convincing me that i cant do it without a counter steer

@@rokmerse9551 If not using your hands, only leaning, the bike will counter steer by itself. That method won't work for this locked-handlebar bike. They didn't show it in the vid, but if you locked the handlebar and pushed the bike down a hill, it will crash...

First mistake, do this standing. Then it is way more simple.

True, its basically a required skill if your going 30mph or faster.

Push right go right

@@randomcreativename And yet not taught in UK bike tests. Almost killed me on my 2nd or 3rd solo ride. Weird how varied different countries teaching priorities are, and the UK test is otherwise very rigorous.

@@jonboy602 that sucks

I'm glad I saw this comment as I actually am getting my first bike around Christmas with the help of my dad so I'm trying to learn what I can before I start my lessons

@Glen Spivey I do the same to my friends that ride.Telling them you push left to go right, they think I'm crazy. Keith Code explained this in his book "twist of the wrist" .

Most newbie motorcycle riders overshoot because of that.
When they ride fast and encounter a curve, they often steer where the road is going, then accident happens.

@@renken240 You mean push right (handlebar) to go right, right?

I thought the same thing too. Had a feeling its about counter steering.

@Glen Spivey yes. I too do that with my pillion showing them counter steering and it blows their mind. Lol

Yea, it is amazing when it clicks for you. You can steer with one hand while moving your body around, and still maintain perfect stability and directional control.

How long ago did you learn? That's what they teach new riders where I am (Oregon, US). They emphasize it a lot.

I changed over to a trike years ago. I still have to fight my instincts when I ride.

thing is everyone does it and doesn't need to be taught.

I ride a Vulcan 2000 myself and I never knew why motorcycle riders felt like they just HAD to explain counter steering.
If you've ridden a bicycle, you already know what counter steering is. The moment you hop on a motorcycle you already know about counter steering.
Yet for some reason bikers feel like they gotta tell people about it.
Tell people to keep their legs tucked in at low speeds as opposed to sticking them out, better advice, people instinctively stick their legs out to balance but it actually decreases your stability.

even at low speed really, starting from 30 kph (20 mph ? idk) you're really only using counter steering, but at 15 kph (10mph) you start feeling it already

Profile pic checks out.

@@SwainixFPV you're using it even when doing extremely slow speeds to initiate a lean. Motojitsu has a video on it

@@sly9889 depends on the maneuver for me, on a tight U turn yes, but it's more like having more space to work with than counter steering. On a slow slalom like the one you have to do to get your permit in The Netherlands you're not counter steering

@@SwainixFPV You will be counter-steering even at very low speed, but the effort required will be so little, it’s virtually imperceptible.

I think it also demonstrates just how complex physics is as a field. We don't even know everything about the things we know.

@Check my about page link get a life dude nobody is doing that

I also think a bicycle is far from a simple object

I agree.. they truly are amazing... but I will point out that mountain bikes have had great improvements in capability in the past 10 years. They refer to it as "the geometry" of the bike.. proportions and angles have greatly changed in the past decade, making a tremendously more capable mountain biking machine. I had no idea until 2 years ago when I finally got a nice "trail bike".. It took me a month of research to understand what I was getting into.
I've always ridden for my entire life and I'm 39. I was blind to what MTB really was.. I watch a lot of KRplus..lol😄.. My skills have come a long way since then.
In fact, MTB races have actually gotten more gnarly and technical in these past years because of the advancements and further understanding of bike geometry and suspension.. Suspension is a whole other subject.. it's also advanced greatly in these past years..
I highly recommend MTB.. Now is the best time to get into it.. bikes are better than ever.. I wish I had discovered it much younger.
I guess in it's essence, I can agree with you though.. we've been using derailleurs since way back.. The basic design holds true.. a bike is a bike. If ya haven't caught on, I love biking!😆

Just like bow..and archery in general. The physics behind them are really complex. Different bow shapes, materials, dimensions and also arrow length and arrowheads for different tasks. If we were to calculate precise trajectory of arrow ... we would have had so many variables to include. When we put them down to mathematical formulas and geometric shapes, they are like really complex stuff. But you don't have to understand it when you have visiual feedback on your inputs instantly.

Ughh I'll stop buying Dura-Ace now.

I'd disagree. A car that can run by exploding gas in a cylinder is by far more ingenious.

False, talk to anyone who owns a recumbent.

i wonder if this means there's a more instructive way to teach someone how to ride bikes now...

our mind is more complex than we think bro

our does things we don't even know

I found it funny that obviously the bike researchers were Dutch from TU Delft haha

I'm in Pennsylvania.. I been riding my whole life.. that kinda blows my mind that before a turn, you turn the other way first.. I ride A LOT! To realize this after all these years🤯🤯😲

Or point out to the video and say, "I learned it by doing not understanding"

Nono, I gotta sound smart, and then when they inevitably ask again I'll point them to the video

compete with my cylcing skills i bmx an i bet i could burn yo as up out the dig 25 tooth single gear is all i need to suply the gap sauce

@@729Crew who cares lol

@@dimitridan8112 im cold on tha bike dawg

Bro I learned motorcycle just in one day... My father just say that I should make it run and ride it and I find it stupid LoL... But luckily I'm not injured and still alive

Btw we sold it tho

With heavier wheels, but mostly because of higher speeds, coriollis effct comes into action. It means turnig the wheel to the left will produce a torque to roll you to the right.
Hopefully this goes in the same way so it adds to the effect described in the video and you don't have to act very differently depending on speed. I'm unsure how big each effect is though, but pretty sure the video is correct in not mentionning coriollis on a low speed bicycle while a speed motorcycle is mostly coriollis.

@@anonamemous6865 You didn't learn motorcycle in one day. you managed to ride one. There's a difference and it'll show the first time you find yourself in a bad situation.

I still remember how they taught the counter steer for normal turns and for a quick wobble avoidance you don't counter turn, but you have to wobble quickly back.

It will fall as fast as stationary bike.

I was waiting for that.

The minuitephysics video showed this demonstration. Worth checking out

It's been done before. Bicycles with locked steering fall over immediately when rolling.

I was about to ask this